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Letter to the Editor: Polls tell a different story


With both conventions behind us now, polling results show a close race with no substantial lead for either presidential candidate. Incumbent presidents may be hard to defeat, but it seems that America's broken-down economy and dismal unemployment numbers would have Mitt Romney well ahead of President Obama at this point. The polling numbers, if accurate, do not reflect our president's record.

Maybe we should review what America needed nearly four years ago and compare that to what his policies have delivered.

  • We needed job growth and we got record unemployment.
  • We needed a strong economy and we got economic stagnation.
  • We needed to grow America's wealth and we got more printed money.
  • We needed spending controls and we got out of control spending.
  • We needed private sector growth and we got private sector decline.
  • We needed leadership that would unify Congress and we got party gridlock.
  • We needed lower gas prices and gas prices have doubled.
  • We needed military strength and we got military spending cuts and sequestration.
  • We needed constitutional freedom and we got contraceptive mandates.
  • We needed respect and good will from Muslim countries and we got hate and contempt.
  • We needed free market support and we got attacks on our free market system.
  • We needed, "We the people" representation according to our constitution and we got, "That's what is best for America", from Barack Obama.

How's that for hope and change? How's that for an America going forward? How does a record like that translate into a polling advantage?

Leroy Donald, Stephens City


Sorry you're so disappointed. Go on and vote for Romney then, no one's stopping you. He'll surely fix everything and America will swiftly be restored as the land of milk and honey.

Beckrose, thats a good one! they act like the day after romney is elected things will be fixed.

Neither comment disputes Mr. Donald's points, which are indisputable. Typical liberal response...discredit the messenger when you can't discredit the message. Four years later and Obama is still blaming George Bush for the poor economy. We gave Obama a chance to improve it and he failed miserably; made it worse, in fact. For proof, compare all the economic indicators and markers between 2008 and now. He has created a division in our country not seen since 1860. Our prestige on the world stage has fallen to an all-time low since he became president. Recall the definition of insanity: repeating the same mistake and expecting a different result. It astounds me that so many people are willing to let him keep his job.

2010 -- Exclusive: Obama stimulus reduced our pain, experts say
President Obama's stimulus package saved jobs — but the government still needs to do more to breathe life into the economy, according to USA TODAY's quarterly survey of 50 economists.
Unemployment would have hit 10.8% — higher than December's 10% rate — without Obama's $787 billion stimulus program , according to the economists' median estimate. The difference would translate into another 1.2 million lost jobs.


2012 -- ...in a survey of leading economists conducted by the University of Chicago’s Booth School of Business, 92 percent agreed that the stimulus succeeded in reducing the jobless rate. On the harder question of whether the benefit exceeded the cost, more than half thought it did, one in three was uncertain, and fewer than one in six disagreed.


You can vote for Romney too. He's YOUR man.

FactCheck.org found the spending Obama inherited "was so high that even modest increases keep it at a level that is extraordinarily lofty by historical standards." As a percentage of Gross Domestic Product, the nation's economic production, spending is running at the highest level since the 1940s.

But tax revenues are also low by historical standards, FactCheck.org found, and are at their lowest level as a percentage of GDP since 1950.

The debt grew to $16 trillion not just because of Obama's actions, but also due to actions taken by present and past presidents and Congresses.

The stimulus package came with a $787 billion price tag. If you include all growth in the national debt under the Obama administration, it’s roughly $5.4 trillion, not $16 trillion. The administration inherited a national debt of more than $10 trillion when it came into office.


A total of 4.4 million jobs had been lost before Obama took office, including 820,000 the month he was sworn in. We are crawling our way UP hill as are many other nations in the world.

A total of 4.4 million jobs had been lost before Obama took office, including 820,000 the month he was sworn in. We are crawling our way UP hill as are many other nations in the world.

Well Mr.Donald If I had to hazard a guess as to why the polls tell a different story is because its not all black and white. Some people have forgotten just how bad the economy bombed. Some do not understand the domino effect, that the immediate failure of one businesses effect isn't felt on another until later.
Others look at the reports of our housing market finally on the rise, employment on the rise instead of job losses and other economic factors, and while we aren't 100% satisfied we don't refuse to see the progress made and aren't willing to easily hand over the reins to retry failed policies of the past.

There are others like my Father who doesn't like Obama but wouldn't vote for Romney if he were paid to. You see, he is the 47% relying on his VA benefits he earned by serving. He works a barely above minimum wage job and supplements his rent by providing handyman services to his landlords properties. He does all this while going through therapy to try to avoid hip replacement surgery as he cant afford to not work. He takes personally Romney's condemnation of him especially after having served his country rather than hide in another. He doesn't view Romney as the lesser evil, he sees him as a different evil much more dangerous in other ways. So he is not voting this election.

Ultimately I believe the polls reflect changing times. Voters don't have to take the "trust me", of politicians any longer. We can within minutes have any economic statistic of choice in front of us direct from the government vs the radio/tv host telling us. When a politician lies about their opponent claiming they said something, we can see within minutes video showing opposite. We can see what a candidate says behind closed door or see what stances they championed for 10 years before but now try to hide. We can see when they fault the poor for using "entitlements" they themselves used. Overall technology has made it more honest. Because while you will have those voters so against whomever they will create all kinds of lies about them, you have more that know the truth.

And the election will reflect that. *my own opinion of course.

OMG! Romney's father was on welfare when they came to the U.S. from Mexico"?



Now let's see how that goes...Mitt doesn't like the 47 percent of people feeling they are "entitled" to government help...however, Daddy Dearest took advantage of that very help???

Oh, Oh, and it gets better...Paul Ryan doesn't like entitlements and wants to revamp Social Security...the VERY SOURCE that financed his education.

Yea, sure, I want these two men at the head of the most powerful country in the world. NOT!!!

Aired on September 22, 2012
Romney: Welfare parents ‘need to go to work’
Before stay-at-home mom controversy, Mitt Romney said parents on welfare "need to go to work."


Allen is not only exaggerating the spending total by President Obama and the Democratic leaders of Congress, he is doing it by including billions of dollars passed under a Republican president. That’s just not false, it’s ridiculous. So we have to set the meter ablaze. Pants on Fire.


All False statements involving George Allen

George Allen

A falsehood that won't die
President Obama's health care law is "a government takeover of healthcare."

George Allen

Flat out wrong
"Our federal government has lent $2 billion to the state-owned oil company of Brazil to allow them to explore for oil and gas."

George Allen

Bottom line increased 45 percent
Takes credit for "reining in" state spending when he was governor.

George Allen

Cherry picks data
"China owns more of our bonds than do Americans."

George Allen

Webb and Warner in sync on 87 percent of votes
Sen. Jim Webb "persists on negating" Sen. Mark Warner’s votes

George Allen

Debt hasn't grown that fast
The debt is "nearly $6 trillion more than when President Obama was sworn into office

Unemployment during Clinton years 5.21%; Bush 5.27%; Obama 9.36%.

Drilling permits approved - Clinton up 58%; Bush up 116%; Obama down 36%.

National debt: Clinton 8 yrs up $1.5B 37%; Bush 8 yrs up $5B 86%; Obama 3 yrs up $3.7B 34% (8yrs = $9.8B ?)

Americans receiving Food Stamps: Clinton 23M; Bush 23.5M; Obama 39.5M

Cabinet Appointments with Private Sector Experience: Clinton 37%; Bush 53%; Obama 8%

Under a Republican Congress from 2003 to 2007, jobs increased by 8.1M. From 2007 to 2010 under a Democrat Congress, we lost 8M jobs.

Obama plans to increase the income tax rate from 35% to 39.6%; income/payroll from 37.4% to 52.2%; capital gains from 15% to 28%; estate (death) from 0% to 55%

And you still want four more years?

What utter nonsense. Just the same old right wing propaganda repeated over and over like a broken record. Fact is that the Romney/Ryan ticket have responded to the worst crisis since the great depression by peddling the same nostrums the right wing has preached for decades; more tax cuts, primarily for the wealthy; continued deregulation of Wall Street who almost destroyed the economy; shredding the social safety net for the weakest and poorest by a determined assault on Medicare, Medicaid, and Social Security with the ultimate goal of privatization. Bottom line is that anyone who is part of the 99% and votes Republican in November needs to have their head examined.

So, valley patriot, did you receive all that good info in an email?

At least I support my statements with the source of the info, where are your sources.

Anyone can put out words and numbers...show us the proof.

vp: " Drilling permits approved - Clinton up 58%; Bush up 116%; Obama down 36%. "

• From 2004-08, well into Bush’s tenure, oil production on federal lands and waters fell in four of five years, for a net decrease of 16.8 percent.

• From 2009-11, the Obama years, oil production rose two of three years, for a net increase of 10.6 percent.


2003 579 101 680 n/a
2004 572 97 669 -1.6%
2005 542 96 638 -4.6%
2006 471 101 572 -10.3%
2007 514 105 619 +8.2
2008 462 104 566 -8.6%
2009 527 105 632 +11.7%
2010 618 108 726 +14.9%
2011 514 112 626 - 13.8%
Source: EIA; some numbers slightly off due to independent rounding in source data


Beck says less than 10 percent of Obama Cabinet has worked in private sector

Kathleen Sebelius, 21st Secretary of Health and Human Services, the second female Governor of Kansas from 2003 to 2009, Sebelius served as executive director and chief lobbyist for the Kansas Trial Lawyers Association (now Kansas Association for Justice) from 1977–1986. //would that be considered "private sector", Glenn ..)She was first elected to the Kansas House of Representatives in 1986. In 1994 she left the House to run for state Insurance Commissioner and stunned political forecasters by winning – the first time a Democrat had won in more than 10 years. She refused to take campaign contributions from the insurance industry and blocked the proposed merger of Blue Cross Blue Shield of Kansas, the state's largest health insurer, with an Indiana-based company. Sebelius's decision marked the first time the corporation had been rebuffed in its acquisition attempts As of 2004, 50% of Kansas voters were registered Republicans, compared to 27% as registered Democrats. Sebelius, nevertheless, won a landslide re-election – with 57.8% – of the vote to Barnett's 40.5%.
In 2001 Sebelius was named as one of Governing Magazine's Public Officials of the Year while she was serving as Kansas Insurance Commissioner.
In November 2005, Time named Sebelius as one of the five best governors in America, praising her for eliminating a $1.1 billion debt she inherited, ferreting out waste in state government, and strongly supporting public education – all without raising taxes, although she proposed raising sales, property, and income taxes.[22] The article also praised her bipartisan approach to governing, a useful trait in a state where Republicans have usually controlled the Legislature.
In February 2006, the White House Project named Sebelius one of its "8 in '08," a group of eight female politicians who could possibly run and/or be elected president in 2008.
In 2009, Forbes named Sebelius the 57th most powerful woman in the world.
In 2010, Forbes named Sebelius the 23rd most powerful woman in the world.
In 2011, Forbes named Sebelius the 13th most powerful woman in the world.

The assertions made by "Mr. Leroy Donald" and supported by "Mr. valley patriot" have been rated "Best Ever" by the National Exaggeration Council.


Here’s the cabinet, listed in succession order, with their private sector experience; members were listed from the White House website; biographical data were taken from Wikipedia, supplemented by official departmental biographies:

Vice President Joe Biden – Private experience: Yes. 4.5% of the cabinet. Biden’s father worked in the private sector his entire life — unsuccessfully for a critical period. Biden attended a private university’s law school (Syracuse), and operated a successful-because-of-property-management law practice for three years before winning election to the U.S. Senate. (I regard a campaign as a private business, too — and Biden’s first campaign was masterful entrepreneurship.)
Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton – Private experience: Yes, significant. 9% of the cabinet. Extremely successful private practice lawyer in Arkansas for the Rose Law Firm, one of the “Top 100 Lawyers” in a classically dog-eat-dog business.
Secretary of Treasury Tim Geithner – Private experience: Yes, significant. 13.6% of the cabinet (The chart’s error is established in the first three people checked — surely no one bothered to make a serious count of the cabinet in compiling the chart.) Geithner traveled with world with his Ford Foundation-employed father. He graduated from private universities, with an A.B. from Dartmouth and an M.A. in economics from Johns Hopkins. Starting his career, he worked three years in the private sector with Kissinger Associates. After significant positions at Treasury and State Departments, he again ventured into the private sector with the Council on Foreign Relations; from there he moved to the Federal Reserve Bank of New York — in what is at worst a semi-public organization. Running a Federal Reserve Branch is among the most intensive jobs one can have in private sector economics and management. If an analyst at a bank named after J. P. Morgan didn’t understand that, one wonders just what the person does understand.
Secretary of Defense Robert Gates – Private sector experience: Yes, at high levels. 18% of the cabinet. Bob Gates spent a career with the Central Intelligence Agency, finally as Director of Central Intelligence, an executive level position with no equal in private enterprise. He retired in 1993, and then worked in a variety of university positions, and joined several different corporate boards; in 1999 he was appointed interim Dean of the George W. Bush School of Government and Public Service at Texas A&M, and was appointed President of Texas A&M in 2002, where he served until his appointment as Secretary of Defense in 2006.
Attorney General Eric H. Holder, Jr – Private sector experience: Yes, significant. 23% of the cabinet, total. After a sterling career in the Justice Department, as a Ronald Reagan appointment to be a federal judge, as a U.S. Attorney, and again at the Justice Department, Holder spent eight years representing high profile private clients at Covington & Burling in Washington, D.C. His clients included the National Football League, the giant pharmaceutical company Merck, and Chiquita Brands, a U.S. company with extensive international business.
Secretary of Interior Kenneth L. Salazar – Private sector experience: Yes. 27% of Obama cabinet. Besides a distinguished career in government, as advisor and Cabinet Member with Colorado Gov. Roy Romer, Salazar was a successful private-practice attorney from 1981 to 1985, and then again from 1994 to 1998 when he won election as Colorado’s Attorney General. As Senator, Salazar maintained a good voting record for a Republican business-supporting senator; Salazar is a Democrat. Salazar’s family is in ranching, and he is usually listed as a “rancher from Colorado,” with life experience in the ranching business at least equal to that of former Supreme Court Justice Sandra Day O’Conner.
Secretary of Agriculture Thomas J. Vilsack - Private sector experience: Yes, significant. 32% of Obama cabinet. Vilsack spent 23 years in private practice as an attorney, 1975 to 1998, while holding not-full-time elective offices such as mayor and state representative. He joined government as Governor of Iowa in 1998, and except for two years, has been in employed in government since then.
Secretary of Commerce Gary F. Locke – Private sector experience: Yes, significant. 36% of Obama cabinet. As near as I can determine, Locke was in private law practice from 1975 through his election as Executive in King County in 1993 (is that a full-time position?). He was elected Governor of Washington in 1996. After leaving office in 2005, he again worked in private practice with Davis Wright Tremaine, LLP, until 2009. 22 years in private practice, three years as Executive of King County, eight years as Governor of Washington.
Secretary of Labor Hilda L. Solis – Private sector experience: Yes, but I consider it insignificant. 36% of Obama cabinet with private sector experience, 4.5% without. Solis’s father was a Teamster and union organizer who contracted lead poisoning on the job; her mother was an assembly line worker for Mattel Toys. She overachieved in high school and ignored her counselor’s advice to avoid college, and earned degrees from Cal Poly-Pomona and USC. She held a variety of posts in federal government before returning to California to work for education and win election to the California House and California Senate, and then to Congress.
Secretary of Health and Human Services Kathleen Sebelius – Private sector experience: Yes, significant. 41% of Obama cabinet with private sector experience, 4.5% without. Former Kansas Governor Kathleen Sebelius worked in the private sector for 12 years, at least nine years as director and lobbyist for the Kansas Association for Justice (then Kansas Trial Lawyers Association). One might understand why the American Enterprise Institute would not count as “business experience” a career built on reining in insurance companies, as Sebelius did as a lobbyist and then elected Kansas Insurance Commissioner.
Secretary of Housing and Urban Development Shaun L.S. Donovan – Private sector experience: Yes, only 4 years, but significant because it bugs AEI analysts so much. 45% of cabinet with private sector experience, 4.5% without. With multiple degrees from Harvard University in architecture and public administration, Donovan was Deputy Assistant Secretary of HUD for Multifamily Housing during the Clinton Administration; and he was Commissioner of the New York City Department of Housing Preservation and Development (HPD). In the private sector, he worked for the Community Preservation Corporation, a non-profit in New York City, and he worked for a while finding sources to lend to people to buy “affordable housing” in the city, a task perhaps equal to wringing blood from a block of granite.
Secretary of Transportation Raymond L. LaHood – Private sector experience: No (not significant); school teacher at Holy Family School in Peoria, Illinois . [As a teacher, I'm not sure that teaching should count as government experience, but it's not really private sector stuff, either. Education isn't as wasteful as for-profit groups.] 45% of cabinet with private sector experience, 9% without. Ironically, it is the Republican former Representative who pulls down the private sector experience percentage in the Obama cabinet.
Secretary of Energy Steven Chu – Private sector experience: Yes, extremely significant. 50% of cabinet with private sector experience, 9% without. Chu worked at Bell Labs , where he and his several co-workers carried out his Nobel Prize-winning laser cooling work, from 1978 to 1987. Having won a Nobel for private sector work, I think we can count his private sector experience as important. Chu also headed the Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory, which is seeded by a government contract to a university but must operate as a very highly-regulated business. (I’ll wager Chu is counted as “no private sector experience,” which demonstrates the poverty of methodology of the so-called “J. P. Morgan” study AEI claims.)
Secretary of Education Arne Duncan – Private sector experience: Yes, significant. 55% of cabinet with private sector experience, 9% without. Duncan earned Academic All-American honors in basketball at Harvard. His private sector is among the more unusual of any cabinet member’s, and more competitive. Duncan played professional basketball : “From 1987 to 1991, Duncan played professional basketball in Australia with the Eastside Spectres of the [Australian] National Basketball League , and while there, worked with children who were wards of the state. He also played with the Rhode Island Gulls and tried out for the New Jersey Jammers.” Since leaving basketball he’s worked in education, about four years in a private company aiming to improve education.
Secretary of Veterans Affairs Eric K. Shinseki – Private sector experience: Yes, but to give AEI and “Morgan” a chance, we won’t count it. 55% of cabinet with private sector experience, 13.6% without. Shinseki is a retired, four-star general in the army, a former Chief of the Joint Chiefs of Staff. While Shinseki served on the boards of a half-dozen corporations, all of that service was in the six years between his official retirement and his appointment as Secretary of Veterans Affairs.
Secretary of Homeland Security Janet A. Napolitano - Private sector experience: Yes, significant. 59% of cabinet with private sector experience, 13.6% without. After a brilliant turn in law school at the University of Virginia, and a clerking appointment with a federal judge, Napolitano joined the distinguished Phoenix firm Lewis & Roca, where she practiced privately for nine years before Bill Clinton appointed her U.S. Attorney for Arizona. AEI probably doesn’t want to count her private sector experience because, among other irritations to them, she was the attorney-advisor to Prof. Anita Hill during her questioning by the Senate Judiciary Committee on the issue of Clarence Thomas’s nomination to be Associate Justice of the Supreme Court.
White House Chief of Staff Rahm I. Emanuel – Private sector experience: Yes, significant. 64% of cabinet with private sector experience, 13.6% without. Emanuel’s major private sector experience is short, but spectacular . “After serving as an advisor to Bill Clinton , in 1998 Emanuel resigned from his position in the Clinton administration and became an investment banker at Wasserstein Perella (now Dresdner Kleinwort ), where he worked until 2002. In 1999, he became a managing director at the firm’s Chicago office. Emanuel made $16.2 million in his two-and-a-half-year stint as a banker, according to Congressional disclosures. At Wasserstein Perella, he worked on eight deals, including the acquisition by Commonwealth Edison of Peco Energy and the purchase by GTCR Golder Rauner of the SecurityLink home security unit from SBC Communications .” J. P. Morgan and AEI wish that Emanuel had not had such smashing success is such a short time.
Environmental Protection Agency Administrator Lisa P. Jackson – Private sector experience: No, significant. 64% of cabinet with private sector experience, 18% without. Despite a brilliant career cleaning up environmental messes, with EPA and the New Jersey State government, Jackson has negligible private sector experience. She was a brilliant student, valedictorian in high school and honors graduate in chemical engineering.
Office of Management & Budget Director Peter R. Orszag – Private sector experience: Yes, short but significant. 68% of cabinet with private sector experience, 18% without. Orszag is the youngest member of the cabinet, but he had a brilliant academic career (Princeton, London School for Economics) and a series of tough assignments in the Clinton Administration. During the Bush years he founded an economic consulting firm, and sold it, and worked with McKinsey and Company, mostly on health care financing (he’s a member of the National Institute of Medicine in the National Academies of Science).
U.S. Trade Representative Ambassador Ronald Kirk – Private sector experience: Yes, long and significant. 73% of cabinet with private sector experience, 18% without. Son of a postal worker, Ron Kirk used academic achievement to get through law school. He practiced privately for 13 years, interspersed with a bit of political work, before being appointed Texas Secretary of State in 1994 — the office that most businesses have most of their state regulatory action with. About a year later he ran for and won election as Mayor of Dallas, considered a major business post in Texas. Re-elected by a huge margin in 1999, he resigned to run for the U.S. Senate in 2002. After losing (to John Cornyn), Price took positions with Dallas and then Houston law firms representing big businesses, especially in government arenas.
U.S. Ambassador to the United Nations Ambassador Susan Rice – Private sector experience: Yes. 77% of cabinet with private sector experience, 18% without. Rice was a consultant with McKinsey and Co., sort of the ne plus ultra of private sectorness, for a while before beginning her climb to U.N Ambassador.
Council of Economic Advisors Chair Christina Romer – Private sector experience: Yes, but academic. We won’t count it to make AEI out to be less of a sucker. 77% of cabinet with private sector experience, 23% without significant private sector experience. Dr. Romer’s chief appointments have been academic, and at a public university, though her education was entirely private. A specialist in the Great Depression and economic data gathering, she’s highly considered by her colleagues, and is a past-president of the American Economic Association.
All totaled, Obama’s cabinet is one of the certifiably most brainy, most successful and most decorated of any president at any time. His cabinet brings extensive and extremely successful private sector experience coupled with outstanding and considerable successful experience in government and elective politics.

Sorry to blow your posting out of the water there, Sparkie.

Could discredit the rest as well but wasted enough time on your Beck disinformation rants.

And, BTW, you Republicans totally overlooked the ONLY honest man of all of your Rep candidates: Jon Huntsman., the man who could probably have defeated Obama.

While governor, Huntsman was named chairman of the Western Governors Association, and joined the Executive Committee of the National Governors Association. Under his leadership, Utah was named the best managed state in America by the Pew Center on the States.[ He won re-election in 2008 with nearly 78% of the vote and left office with approval ratings over 80%

Huntsman, a Mormon, dropped out before graduating to pursue his passion as a keyboard player in a rock band called "Wizard" . Huntsman later obtained a G.E.D. completed college. In Taiwan for a while, staff assistant in President Ronald Reagan's administration. In the 1988 presidential election, under President George H. W. Bush, he was Deputy Assistant Secretary of Commerce for trade development and commerce for East Asian and Pacific Affairs. In June 1992, Bush appointed him to become U.S. Ambassador to Singapore, and was confirmed unanimously by the U.S. Senate in August. When questioned by U.S. Senator Paul Sarbanes, he said that he had been the chairman of Utah's presidential fundraising committee and had donated $2,000 to the Bush campaign, an amount that Sarbanes described as "not a large amount really". He became the youngest U.S. Ambassador to serve in over 100 years. GWBush appointed Huntsman to be one of two Deputy United States Trade Representatives in his administration, Obama nominated Jon Huntsman to serve as the United States Ambassador to China on May 16, 2009 and unanimously confirmed.

Your Republicans continue to pick the WRONG candidate.

The Bush brother should have been JEB.
The Mormon should have been JON.

And I forgot to mention that TWO of HIS sons are serving in the US Navy.

Since my one son gave many years of his life, Desert Storm, etc; it REALLY impresses me that Huntsman's children are serving.

Sources: Unemployment - BLS; Drilling Permits - Bureau of Land Mgt; Nat'l Debt - Snopes; Food Stamps - HHS & OMB; Private Sector Experience - read their bios and look for employment/ownership of a profit seeking enterprise; Jobs - BLS; Tax plan - WSJ

Ms. Mackie, Bush created the first stimulus. No credit?

You could be right.

And, in all this off-the-wall hearsay rhetoric nobody, but nobody speaks for the most vulnerable among us:


John Horne violates his own rules. His 'Realityisfree' website prohibits users from using that board for recruiting.

Yet, here he is on the NVD board recruiting. Ironic?

Whoever is in office next.....

*we need to keep our money and spending in this country....and keep our military closer to home.

vp: "Ms. Mackie, Bush created the first stimulus. No credit?"

Economic Stimulus Act of 2008? Unless I missed something, GWB's tax rebate gave our economy a bounce of 2.4% in the second quarter of 2008; not much long range benefit. I don't know whether this was 'rushed' through to try to influence his approval rating or not, but many of overseas military families didn't even receive it. Nada. A very, very short lived gesture. And GWB still walked out of office with less than a 20 percent approval rating.

TARP? It was the success that it could have been, as I understand it, because it was handed over to the financial institutions without guidance or drestriction. The financial institutions have been accused of not using the loaned dollars for its intended reason.

Neil Barofsky, Special Inspector General for the Troubled Asset Relief Program (SIGTARP), told lawmakers, "Inadequate oversight and insufficient information about what companies are doing with the money leaves the program open to fraud, including conflicts of interest facing fund managers, collusion between participants and vulnerabilities to money laundering. In its October 2011 quarterly report to Congress, SIGTARP reported "more than 150 ongoing criminal and civil investigations." SIGTARP had already achieved criminal convictions of 28 defendants (19 had already been sentenced to prison), and civil cases naming 37 individuals and 18 corporate/legal entities as defendants. It had recovered $151 million, and prevented $553 million going to Colonial Bank, which failed (Another mess he left for Obama to clean up!)
While TARP funds have been provided to bank holding companies, those holding companies have only used a fraction of such funds to recapitalize their bank subsidiaries. On October 24, 2008, PNC Financial Services received $7.7 billion in TARP funds, then only hours later agreed to buy National City Corp. for $5.58 billion, an amount that was considered a bargain. The Senate Congressional Oversight Panel created to oversee the TARP concluded on January 9, 2009: "In particular, the Panel sees no evidence that the U.S. Treasury has used TARP funds to support the housing market by avoiding preventable foreclosures". The panel also concluded that "Although half the money has not yet been received by the banks, hundreds of billions of dollars have been injected into the marketplace with no demonstrable effects on lending.

During 2008, companies that received $295 billion in bailout money had spent $114 million on lobbying and campaign contributions.

Banks that received bailout money had compensated their top executives nearly $1.6 billion in 2007, including salaries, cash bonuses, stock options, and benefits including personal use of company jets and chauffeurs, home security, country club memberships, and professional money management. (wikipeda)

So, vp, maybe you can answer my question...should GWB receive credit?

Oops...TARP was NOT rpt NOT the success...

Ahh that TARP, thats probably what I used last on my last trip helping someone move nice furniture.

I'll be glad when these darn elections are over, so we can talk about the NOW!

What everybody misses is the risk we face from voting for either of the Dominionist Empire Musical Chairs Party candidates.

The risk is spelled out in detail at:


Personally, I plan to vote for my neighbor's cat:

* Visits daily;
* Checks to see if we have any problems;
* Courteous;
* Affectionate;
* Never asks for money;
* Never lies;
* Never promises what he can't deliver;
* Doesn't try to frighten us with threats of WMD or bogeymen;
* Doesn't waste money on foreign wars;
* Doesn't give borrowed money to foreign rascals;
* Doesn't wander all over the globe looking for trouble;
* Doesn't snoop under our bed;
* Doesn't try to control our thoughts;
* Doesn't try to dictate our relationships;
* Doesn't interfere with medical decisions;
* Doesn't make loud noise when we try to sleep;
* Always protective of the environment.

During our walks we have identified two other cats with similar qualities. One would make a great Vice-President and the other would be a terrific Secretary of State.

Appears to be a formidable opponent. If there are no embarrassing sex tapes floating around out there I will be all in with you!

Besides all the other half facts in this editorial, can someone explain to me how they think the president controls the gas prices? This is a world traded commodity, how does one guy in the US control the price, besides keeping our tax lower than in other countries? You can't make a serious argument about the state of our country if you don't understand how things work. Silly.

"Q Mr. President, in February you were asked about Americans facing the prospect of $4 a gallon gasoline and you said you hadn't heard of that at the time. Gas prices

THE PRESIDENT: Aware of it now.

Q Gas prices are now approaching $5 a gallon in some parts of the country. Offshore oil exploration is obviously a long-term approach. What is the short-term advice for Americans? What can you do now to help them?

THE PRESIDENT: First of all, there is a psychology in the oil market that basically says, supplies are going to stay stagnant while demand rises. And that's reflected somewhat in the price of crude oil. Gasoline prices are reflected -- the amount of a gasoline price at the pump is reflected in the price of crude oil. And therefore, it seems like it makes sense to me to say to the world that we're going to use new technologies to explore for oil and gas in the United States -- offshore oil, ANWR, oil shale projects -- to help change the psychology, to send a clear message that the supplies of oil will increase.

Secondly, obviously good conservation measures matter. I've been reading a lot about how the automobile companies are beginning to adjust -- people -- consumers are beginning to say, wait a minute, I don't want a gas guzzler anymore, I want a smaller car. So the two need to go hand in hand.

There is no immediate fix. This took us a while to get in this problem; there is no short-term solution.

I think it was in the Rose Garden where I issued this brilliant statement: If I had a magic wand -- but the President doesn't have a magic wand. You just can't say, low gas. It took us a while to get here and we need to have a good strategy to get out of it.

Q But you do have the Strategic Oil Petroleum Reserve. What about opening that?

THE PRESIDENT: The Strategic Oil Petroleum Reserve is for, you know, emergencies. But that doesn't address the fundamental issue. And we need to address the fundamental issue, which I, frankly, have been talking about since I first became President -- which is a combination of using technology to have alternative sources of energy, but at the same time finding oil and gas here at home. And now is the time to get it done. I heard somebody say, well, it's going to take seven years. Well, if we'd have done it seven years ago we'd be having a different conversation today. I'm not suggesting it would have completely created -- you know, changed the dynamics in the world, but it certainly would have been -- we'd have been using more of our own oil and sending less money overseas.

George W. Bush
A Mid-Summer Press Conference
Washington, D.C.
July 15, 2008

justwondering, This may be the answer

"And we need to address the fundamental issue, which I, frankly, HAVE BEEN TALKING* ABOUT SINCE repeat SINCE I FIRST BECAME PRESIDENT." ~GW Bush

*talking? Eight years? And still 'talking about ' with six (6) months left in office? And people cannot comprehend why we still blame GW for much of the mess we are facing today!

Jane, that's usually your answer - blame Bush.

Democrats and Republicans disagree on energy policy, but this they share: Both shade the facts on the complex issue for political advantage.

Republicans say repealing oil industry tax breaks will drive up costs at the pump. However, nonpartisan congressional analysts and industry experts say higher taxes would have little or no effect on gasoline prices.
Senate Democratic leaders asked the Federal Trade Commission to investigate oil refiners for limiting supply "to keep prices artificially high." But the FTC says the "vast majority" of past investigations found "market factors," not collusion, to be the cause of price spikes.
President Barack Obama in a weekly address said policies already adopted by the administration "could save families as much as $3,000 at the pump." Maybe so. But that's an administration estimate of cumulative net savings over six years for somebody buying a new car in 2016.
Sen. Rand Paul claimed that oil companies earn only 7 cents on a gallon of gasoline. Not true. That figure does not include profit from producing and selling crude oil, so it grossly underestimates the amount companies earn on high gasoline prices. One oil analyst calls the figure "disingenuous."


In an email to constituents, Republican Sen. David Vitter of Louisiana claims “the Obama administration shut down the entire offshore oil and gas industry” after the 2010 Gulf of Mexico oil spill. That’s not true.

The administration halted the drilling of all new wells for one month. And the Interior Department issued a months-long moratorium on deepwater drilling. New safety requirements also slowed down the permitting process for shallow-water drilling.

But existing offshore wells continued to pump out natural gas and oil.


I just heard a titillating rumor saying Teabillies furnish and decorate their basements with whips and chains. Yee gads and gadzooks!! Far be it for me to suggest this quirky quirk suggests the practice of self-flagellation is widely practiced. But it would go a long ways to explain why on these forums these zealots keep coming back for more punishment.

Isn't it too bad there isn't any hell waiting for me when I die? Someone tell me again how us evangelical fundamentalists can obtain the services of 72 virgins?


If that is your read, DEBT, guilty as charged.

Actually, the point is... the president -- whoever he or she may be -- does not have control of everything that happens esp as related to world markets. Please see the post after the one to which you commented.

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